PBs greed has no limits - Best time to cut your losses is always now

I totally agree with you Emitz. I had that feeling a couple of times. Starting, I think, a year ago, I stopped spending 2 or 3 times, but the game got me into it again and again. The only fact that I’m still here is, that I really love my guild and also, like most people, are very in touch with Disney.

You can’t even call this a grind anymore, it’s only P2W, and that for a long time now. (Maybe not for the newest server, but be warned, you’ll agree with us soon…) I don’t have the exact numbers, but I don’t think a F2P player can keep up 15 or even 5 heroes at cap right now, the stamina needed is just astronomical.

Also the fact, that the millions of influence earned by a guild, just vanish in the void without getting any useful perk (the 3% double drop chance is still for chapter 22 and lower, meanwhile chapter 40 is coming soon). I don’t have much experience with programming, but they once added more levels to perks, it shouldn’t be that hard to add some more. Even if it’s them useless war perks, adding 200 armor or basic damage for 1 Million influence lol.

At the end i wanna say, no matter how much you spend, if you stop spending, it’s nearly like you haven’t spent a cent at all, especially looking into PvP. With the stat boosts of badges being absurdly high, and every new hero has like 100x the base stats of firstly released heroes. You can only do well in PvP for about 2 patches, then you are way to far behind.

I don’t even wanna know how many money I spend, having like 80% of the heroes at R11, but can’t even hold up with lvl cap and skill costs, because of the lack of recourses we get for free. (I mean look at sign in rewards, or the fact that diamond crates still drop blue badges)

After all thanks for the great time Emitz, hopefully we stay together for a longer time (looking forward for Diablo IV). You are a really nice and friendly person, I’m glad that I came together with you and a lot of the people in our guild, even if we lost a lot of good players. Thank you for everything Emitz!! :heart:


First of all, thank you Emitz for your contribution to the players’ community, the very very useful tier list, fun twitch videos, and numerous of tips on both forum and reddit. I am definitely grateful that you have shared your knowledge to all of us. I glad that you are happy with your decision and that you have find another fun game to enjoy and I wish you all the best.


Hi Emitz I’m on the same server as you. I would always use your tier lists and twitch streams for tips. I don’t have interest in your new game your streaming but wish you the best on your twitch channel.

Completely agree with the R19 part it’s a blatant money grab because they have delayed the new rank. I was hoping my petition thread would have got some communication from per blu but nothing.

Totally expecting tonight patch notes to include R19


F2p here. Can keep up with the skills costs and xp for top 15 but stamina oh I don’t even want to talk about that now. It’s astronomical indeed.


We already had someone quit this week because they can’t keep up with the game anymore and feel like they are falling behind.

Thanks for everything, Emitz! You’re a great person and hope you keep having fun with the new game. Your tier lists were a huge help for me. Unlike some lists that people keep spreading like wildfire, you were actually testing your heroes and not just trying to force your POV. They were really the best.

I agree with everything you said. There was a big forum post about it back in July. Polaris even commented how it has generated discussion among the team, there were dev chats how devs are aware costs are rising faster than earnings, how they agree badges could be simplified. Flash forward to today, nothing has changed.

My first ever FTN contest was in September (Mulan contest). Back then, I just needed 487th to be top 1%. Last FTN, 190th wasn’t good enough for top 1%. And the population just keeps decreasing every passing week. Inability to keep up with the costs and cap raises (for older players) and inability to catch up (for newer players) are always the reason I hear when people quit.
PB thinks they can repopulate with making newer servers and then merging and rinse and repeat. But they don’t realize these newest servers started at R+4 (which already has huge badge/gold/chip costs), not purple ranks like s21 and s22 so they will never regain these population numbers. Eventually, they will reach the threshold where making the game isn’t sustainable and pull the plug.

It’s a great game for IP, heroes, pvp, mechanics, social aspect. But the way run it - badges/gold/chips costs - the less said, the better.


I feel you. A couple of days ago when I joined your stream you asked how I feel about the current state of the game. Since I didn’t had the time to answer here we go:

Same, bro. Same. I stopped charging my google account some weeks ago due to the huge amount of money that is needed for just maxing the discs I use. I started another account @S24 just to get aware of the ridiculously bad deals they provide there. As all of us know: These games are about pay to win. Not a big surprise one starts to remember that when you stop spending. But it is indeed a surprise how the fun, or even any kind of gameplay vanishes when you do so. There just isn’t any “content” left, that is worth playing.

Most “fun” for me was invasion lately. But let’s be honest: benifits go near zero for the amount of time you have to spend. To raise my personal bar I would have to use some kind of autoclicker or bot or whatever. But what for?

While the game was quite a fun ride for me for two or three years now and I really appreciated having some fun without changing the room and switching my computer on, plus the money spent didn’t hurt that much, it has an end in a couple of weeks. I will spend the tiny amount left on my google account on some guild gifts and have some nice chatter with my guild mates on S5 and S24 and then just leave this “game”

While I avoided PoE for some years now due to looking quite complicated (and Diablo 3 just still beeing very rewarding) I will take a look at it soon. That was planned anyway, but maybe finding you there is indeed an additional motivation. :slight_smile:

P.S.: Haven’t told my fellow guild mates about quitting yet. Now they know. :smiley:

P.P.S.: Needless to say, how much you did for the community of this game. I think it’s not too much to say: You’ll be missed.


Another left :frowning: A long time and dedicate player :frowning:

Even though I didnt know you personally, I still feel sad. It seems everyone who invest in this game sooner or later will quit. Just like Aurora Veil…

Sometimes I wonder, do people at Perblue feel anything seeing their dedicate supporter leave? Do they even know what should they do to prevent that? Or they just dont even care? In the slightess?


First of all, really sad that you Emitz and Rinzler are leaving the game, but thank you two for being such a good help to the community and I hope you two have for the most part enjoyed the game while you played :-).

And yeah, the comments you Emitz and Rinzler as top spenders in server 5 really echoes my post, as in that the more P2W/P2P a game is the more likely players are to leave or stop spending, which in turn make PerBlue make the game even more P2W/P2P which cause more players to leave stop spending.

A negative feedback loop that is just making it worse and worse for both players enjoyment wise and for the developers revenue wise, thereby eventually leading to the game economy collapsing if not prevented.

If PerBlue want to stabilize their player base in the sense of making players less likely leave or stop spending money they need to focus on Player Satisfaction, which means making the game technically easier and less grindy, but at the same time more fun and the players more likely want to spend because they are having a good time.

Although, all that said it is really sad to see such good community contributors, but I wish you Emitz and Rinzler the best of luck and hope you two find games both of you enjoy in the future as well, whether that be Path of Exile or an another game :-).


As a fellow 1000 day top player, community contributor, and friend from the same server - I highly respect you and thank you sincerely for your candid response. I’ll see you in DH for the next few weeks and hope you join me out of DH in the future for some fun gaming sessions.

Been an absolute pleasure and all the very best!!


Let me remark on my brief history a bit.

I joined the game around the time Timon and Pumbaa were released to S1 (if to be exact my S1 account is 571 days old, equals July 29). I played till late August when I had a break due to my bachelor exams.

My main game was SEGA Heroes by Demiurge, which at the time was much more P2W than Disney Heroes. I did start spending the money I used on SEGA Heroes on Disney Heroes instead during late November/early December, the cap was already R3. In late January I started to feel the money-struggle, the very same we face today. The problem itself started with R5, which used O7-O8 badges, making them exponentially harder to craft.

Here I am today, with R18 and R19 coming around the corner due to (what I call) an extreme Trello fail with new rank. EVERYONE anticipated the new rank as a final relieve of raising some unwanted (=bad) characters (we all have them don´t we?).
The conception of R18 badges is getting pretty stupid. You need R18 badge bits, R12, R5-R6, O8-R0 and then purple badges below that cost the most. Where the game failed to me is that PerBlue does not account the increase in badge craft difficulty by subsiding the lower badges craft (by lowering bits needed or stamina to raid chapters).

Besides, I could afford (I can´t say raise, because it can´t be done without spending) 42 characters at R17-R18. But all the others were stuck at either R0 (thought it was a good idea = WRONG) OR O0. The conception of having 2/3 of roster 26 ranks behind the cap calls for how stupid the system is. There is barely any exponential gain to talk about. No, the gains raise linearly. If you are enough aware of maths, a linear function can be above exponential for a very short time, then is always BELOW it.

I decided to ONLY support PerBlue via buying Stamina deals (with nothing else inside) when they appear from now on. Granted they don´t appear more than thrice a month, there´s no way for me to buy more than six of them anyway.

The stamina costs of earlier chapters need to progressively decrease, more free stamina needs to be given and BADGE BAZAAR BADGES NEED TO BE ALL EQUIPPABLE ON CHARACTERS THAT NEED BADGES, NOT THE NEXT RANK ONES FOR THOSE THAT HAVE ALL EQUIPPED.


Thanks For All things you did, You were a really helpful guy for me and many others to help them in DH:BM
And Honestly I think The Best Thing i had done
in game things is I havent spend in this game!
And The Grinding of Stamina/Drinks/Gold is Just OMG!

  • Invasion- Badge Bazaar Is Great But A R18 Badge is 100k So 2 R18 badges per invasion Lol
  • Heist- Do I need to say something?
  • Arena/Coli- I cant max any toon so easily, While I upgrade and keep up with new heroes, A new hero is launched or Cap raise which makes me more and more behind in Arena Coli
  • Campaign - I know Stamina Rate wont decrease Believe me, PB is much more greedy than you think , Hub has so many chapters…
    Waiting for a day when one raid will take 50 stamina lol…Hope I’ll quit before that day comes
  • Guild War - Oh Really A Together work, Some dont chat, Some dont understand, And War Matching Meh, Fighting with Sanctuary,Dvcn/ Top Guilds make it so less fun to even play war.
  • Time is Money, I have throwed alot time in this game, But The Stamina/Gold Etc requirement are making me loose all motivations to spend my time here… If It wasn’t a disney game, I would have quit after economical changes

Thanks,Thats what i wanted to say

And Btw Thanks Emitz Again for Helping numerous people by your valuable informations!



Basically all PerBlue thinks will keep us in. Kind of right, but does not make us keep our expenditure.


When it comes to stamina expenditure, I already gave up.
I’m only up around Red12 for most of my best characters and every time I raise them up, I look at the stamina consumed and lament it used up so much just for one level or one badge.

For characters in the orange grade, I simply don’t do it at all, even though I want to.
And in some cases, I need to, the bar for Friendship discs/campaign has been raised to Red level minimum, but I can’t give them what they should be using.


Thank you @Emitz your tier lists have saved everyone who is aware of them a small fortune and allowed us to at least compete. If PB cannot fathom what they have forced on loyal and spending players now then there is truly no hope. When they started with the solo deals I called it quits then only for my guild to bring me back but this does feel like the final straw. All the best with your future endeavours and hope to come into cyber contact with you in the future


Emitz полностью поддерживаю тебя,pb убил интерес к игре очень очень давно… Играю только из-за друзей,не более того … Это не игра,а сбор средств… Плати ,плати ,плати …
Уже надоело и новый Хаб просто ужасный,я так надеялся на лучшее,но они включают свой насос для денег снова… Убивая и высасывая из игры все последнее…


Thank you Emitz. I’m in your server, I watched your streams, I used your tiers a lot… actually, I found this discussion while I was searching for your tier list… It’s sad to see you go, but I understand your reason and I support you in your decision.
I haven’t spent much on the game, and it’s quite some time I stopped spending, because everything I do seems to have no effect on my game. I’m always far behind, I definitely can’t keep up. It’s true, I’m only your average player and PerBlue definitely doesn’t care about people like me, but if I feel disappointed by this game, I can’t imagine how bad you and the other really dedicated players feel.
By the way, I wish you all the best.


It would be nice to think that this post, coming from someone who’s played such a key role in the community for so long, would motivate PerBlue to make some substantive changes. It would also be nice if licensing/rights issues could be resolved so as to allow full, unedited releases of WKRP in Cincinnati, The Muppet Show, and Muppet Babies on Blu-ray; I think that’s about as likely to happen.

Yes, I remember that post; hard to believe it’s been seven months. I will say that, thanks mainly to Endless Surge and, to a lesser extent, the reduction in mercenary costs, gold income is no longer an issue for me, and I suspect that’s true for nearly all players who care to spend time in surge and who’re in a guild that doesn’t make it difficult to farm creep surge for gold. Hero XP is also more plentiful, although that’s entirely due to the Mega Mart, which means spending lots of diamonds on XP that can’t be spent on other resources.

If there were some indication of badge costs being addressed, I would be pretty happy with the progress made in the game since that post. Unfortunately, the only indication we’ve gotten regarding badge costs is that they’re going to cost even more stamina in the future. That’s not an encouraging sign.


The thing that’s frustrating too is that I worked so long to get to higher reds on “older” heroes (Merida, Moana, Sully, Jack-Jack, etc) and I’m basically told by some here that they are pretty worthless now because they can’t stand up to the newer heroes. I’m not completely convinced of that since it does seem they sometimes hold their own, but not always. However, they are like R14-R7 (I can’t even keep them all on the same level because of all the farming that needs to be done just to get one badge). So if I can’t even have my classic 5 up to a high level, how the frell am I supposed to raise new toons that are able to compete up to a competitive level? Instead of focusing on new toons, they need to fix old issues. For instance, this week’s Mastery challenge isn’t something so many people can complete because they’ve mastered everything (even I’m hard pressed to be able to complete it because I only have 2 levels left, meaning only about 3-4 toons who can earn points). However, a refresh of the Mastery system is in order, whether it’s adding to the current levels, adding new characters to existing collections, or even adding new collections (Big Hero 6, Muppets, etc.).


Absolutely respect and support you @Emitz
PB is totally don’t care about ALL players (F2P, dolphins or whales), they just grab all money that we give them and can’t stop. They just use our love to Disney.
PB don’t have any conscience
I already left this game
And I am happy
I am free

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